Objectively correct take. I was shocked at how negatively people were reacting. Of course people quickly jumped to it being some sort of "Satanic" ritual. As a frat bro myself, I just laughed. Funny and harmless prank that, at best, deserves a very light slap on the wrist and a half-sincere "now don't go doing that again." As you say, just don't record it. It is so funny though that trads will moan and groan about muh feminism and muh lack of manliness in society, then turn around and act like insane schoolmarms over stuff like this. Very effeminate behavior.
I admit I expect more from priests than I expect from myself, and I don’t share your “harmless shenanigans” estimate of the situation. I have priest friends who are also raising their eyebrows at this story.
However, I agree that the priesthood is a brotherhood in Christ before anything else. Fraternity is a delicate thing, and it’s under attack in all modes of modern life, as you describe.
In defense of yeti blood oaths, not so much.
In defense of strong bonds between fishers of men? Absolutely.
My college sports team used to go camping by a river each year. One year a dude got blackout drunk and we painted his foot black with a sharpie. When he woke up we told him he got a disease from the river, he freaked out and tried to fight everyone. It was hilarious.
To this day, the team designates a ‘black foot’ at each annual camping trip. I feel bad for those criticizing the yeti ritual. I’m sorry yall never had fun
"Hanging out with the guys" has a mental association with "distant and unavailable dad who makes his wife do everything" in the general population due to largely fictional family dynamics from generations ago.
In my admittedly limited experience, quite a few male standards of sociality and ‘fun,’ from those that could otherwise be argued for very well to those that are obviously degenerate, are upheld through normalizing those who disagree or don’t play along being shamed as basically a ‘no fun poopyhead’ in circles and contexts that would otherwise be innocuous and intelligent. As such, this meathead characterization is probably appropriate and I’m perfectly fine with being an ‘apathetic’ party-pooper.
Also, given that that addiction and a rough upbringing are primary aspects of his personal history that he discussed both in writing and interviews, I’m not sure showing J. D. Vance passed out at a party was well-advised.
I think medieval guilds provided this vector for communion in the past. How can missionaries evangelize souls without having some tomfoolery in their anthropological arsenal. As the author said, I too laughed when I saw it. It was indeed absurdly delicious.
A few weeks ago Fr John was named the director of formation at the apostolate I’ve been a missionary with for 2 years, and which I will now help run; Creatio. I saw this article yesterday, smiled, and had these exact same thoughts. We made a good choice for formater
Seminarians are not your run of the mill "frat boys" when they are with their formator (the genius that created the prank). Seminarians have multiple ways and opportunities to build those trusted brotherly bonds, but not instigated as a blood oath by the man entrusted in leading them into the priesthood. Going on a ski trip with fellow seminarians, and led by a seminary formator, is not the only opportunity to build fraternity and strong bonds among seminarians.
Just as an update to your points of reference:
Knights rite of initiation are no longer secretive, in fact they are open to family, including children. They were as you described, but like all corporate institutions, they evolve and update with the times.
Not all Knights are in the Degree where they wear the beret - most Knights do not wear any uniform. The photo represents those Knights that have achieved the Patriotism degree which would be appropriate to wear the navy blue suit and a beret to go with it. I think it calling a navy blue suit, a tie and beret militia-style. Would be interesting to see Navy SEAL team wear that outfit in their operations.
I think you could have made your point with less drama and without the need to casually lump the Knights with the Weathermen or the KKK.
Most priests do not make a vow of poverty. Priests affiliated with some religious orders might, but not all religious orders require a vow of poverty. Your regular church priest is also saving like all of us for their retirement.
> Seminarians are not your run of the mill "frat boys" when they are with their formator (the genius that created the prank). Seminarians have multiple ways and opportunities to build those trusted brotherly bonds, but not instigated as a blood oath by the man entrusted in leading them into the priesthood.
Yeah, it was a little over the top. Still nothing worthy of more than a mild reprimand, not the hyperventilating reaction from online Catholics. The priest has an excellent track record.
> Going on a ski trip with fellow seminarians, and led by a seminary formator, is not the only opportunity to build fraternity and strong bonds among seminarians.
But it is an opportunity for a truly bizarre and memorable experience. Even seminarians do "frat boy" pranks, and there's nothing wrong with that.
> Knights rite of initiation are no longer secretive, in fact they are open to family, including children. They were as you described, but like all corporate institutions, they evolve and update with the times.
That's lame. They weren't when I started. This bolsters my point more than anything though. As everyone knows, "updating with the times" isn't necessarily a good thing. You would also be mistaken if enemy organizations are "updating with the times" in similar ways.
> I think it calling a navy blue suit, a tie and beret militia-style.
It's obvious they were going for a militant style, just like the hats and swords in the previous iteration.
> I think you could have made your point with less drama and without the need to casually lump the Knights with the Weathermen or the KKK.
My point is Fraternal orgs can be used for good or evil, but their core purpose, fellowship and belonging, are common. Eliminating the ability to create these bonds to remove the ability of bad orgs to take advantage of people will also destroy the good ones.
> Most priests do not make a vow of poverty.
Well aware. I don't remember saying anything contrary in my article though.
Objectively correct take. I was shocked at how negatively people were reacting. Of course people quickly jumped to it being some sort of "Satanic" ritual. As a frat bro myself, I just laughed. Funny and harmless prank that, at best, deserves a very light slap on the wrist and a half-sincere "now don't go doing that again." As you say, just don't record it. It is so funny though that trads will moan and groan about muh feminism and muh lack of manliness in society, then turn around and act like insane schoolmarms over stuff like this. Very effeminate behavior.
Agree
Good piece Mr Schmidt,
I admit I expect more from priests than I expect from myself, and I don’t share your “harmless shenanigans” estimate of the situation. I have priest friends who are also raising their eyebrows at this story.
However, I agree that the priesthood is a brotherhood in Christ before anything else. Fraternity is a delicate thing, and it’s under attack in all modes of modern life, as you describe.
In defense of yeti blood oaths, not so much.
In defense of strong bonds between fishers of men? Absolutely.
My college sports team used to go camping by a river each year. One year a dude got blackout drunk and we painted his foot black with a sharpie. When he woke up we told him he got a disease from the river, he freaked out and tried to fight everyone. It was hilarious.
To this day, the team designates a ‘black foot’ at each annual camping trip. I feel bad for those criticizing the yeti ritual. I’m sorry yall never had fun
A huge part of the problem is the idea of you will either at/going to work or with your family. Anything thing else is "anti-social".
"Hanging out with the guys" has a mental association with "distant and unavailable dad who makes his wife do everything" in the general population due to largely fictional family dynamics from generations ago.
In my admittedly limited experience, quite a few male standards of sociality and ‘fun,’ from those that could otherwise be argued for very well to those that are obviously degenerate, are upheld through normalizing those who disagree or don’t play along being shamed as basically a ‘no fun poopyhead’ in circles and contexts that would otherwise be innocuous and intelligent. As such, this meathead characterization is probably appropriate and I’m perfectly fine with being an ‘apathetic’ party-pooper.
Also, given that that addiction and a rough upbringing are primary aspects of his personal history that he discussed both in writing and interviews, I’m not sure showing J. D. Vance passed out at a party was well-advised.
I think medieval guilds provided this vector for communion in the past. How can missionaries evangelize souls without having some tomfoolery in their anthropological arsenal. As the author said, I too laughed when I saw it. It was indeed absurdly delicious.
A few weeks ago Fr John was named the director of formation at the apostolate I’ve been a missionary with for 2 years, and which I will now help run; Creatio. I saw this article yesterday, smiled, and had these exact same thoughts. We made a good choice for formater
Dear Mr. Schmidt -
A few observations and comments:
Seminarians are not your run of the mill "frat boys" when they are with their formator (the genius that created the prank). Seminarians have multiple ways and opportunities to build those trusted brotherly bonds, but not instigated as a blood oath by the man entrusted in leading them into the priesthood. Going on a ski trip with fellow seminarians, and led by a seminary formator, is not the only opportunity to build fraternity and strong bonds among seminarians.
Just as an update to your points of reference:
Knights rite of initiation are no longer secretive, in fact they are open to family, including children. They were as you described, but like all corporate institutions, they evolve and update with the times.
Not all Knights are in the Degree where they wear the beret - most Knights do not wear any uniform. The photo represents those Knights that have achieved the Patriotism degree which would be appropriate to wear the navy blue suit and a beret to go with it. I think it calling a navy blue suit, a tie and beret militia-style. Would be interesting to see Navy SEAL team wear that outfit in their operations.
I think you could have made your point with less drama and without the need to casually lump the Knights with the Weathermen or the KKK.
Most priests do not make a vow of poverty. Priests affiliated with some religious orders might, but not all religious orders require a vow of poverty. Your regular church priest is also saving like all of us for their retirement.
Thanks for the response:
> Seminarians are not your run of the mill "frat boys" when they are with their formator (the genius that created the prank). Seminarians have multiple ways and opportunities to build those trusted brotherly bonds, but not instigated as a blood oath by the man entrusted in leading them into the priesthood.
Yeah, it was a little over the top. Still nothing worthy of more than a mild reprimand, not the hyperventilating reaction from online Catholics. The priest has an excellent track record.
> Going on a ski trip with fellow seminarians, and led by a seminary formator, is not the only opportunity to build fraternity and strong bonds among seminarians.
But it is an opportunity for a truly bizarre and memorable experience. Even seminarians do "frat boy" pranks, and there's nothing wrong with that.
> Knights rite of initiation are no longer secretive, in fact they are open to family, including children. They were as you described, but like all corporate institutions, they evolve and update with the times.
That's lame. They weren't when I started. This bolsters my point more than anything though. As everyone knows, "updating with the times" isn't necessarily a good thing. You would also be mistaken if enemy organizations are "updating with the times" in similar ways.
> I think it calling a navy blue suit, a tie and beret militia-style.
It's obvious they were going for a militant style, just like the hats and swords in the previous iteration.
> I think you could have made your point with less drama and without the need to casually lump the Knights with the Weathermen or the KKK.
My point is Fraternal orgs can be used for good or evil, but their core purpose, fellowship and belonging, are common. Eliminating the ability to create these bonds to remove the ability of bad orgs to take advantage of people will also destroy the good ones.
> Most priests do not make a vow of poverty.
Well aware. I don't remember saying anything contrary in my article though.