But then, should you not still lose the kids? Parental rights still need to weigh more heavily than they currently do. Things have to be really, really bad before it's better for the child(ren) to live with strangers. We need to give judgmental power back to relatives or the community to intervene, not the state.
In my early childhood my father was physically abusive. I wanted somebody to do something. But I never wanted CPS. I knew that purely because my mother homeschooled us (her choice, my dad didn't care one way or the other and he, to use his own words, knew how to hurt people in ways that didn't leave evidence, so its not like we would have been noticed at school), CPS would not merely take us away from my father but also take me away from mother.
No, who I wanted to do something were the men in the family. Sometimes I wondered if they were just to stupid to notice. Then I wondered if they didn't care. Finally as an adult I realized that the law had mostly stripped them of the power to do anything. Just giving my dad a talking to was pointless. Seperation would only have resulted in split custody (not only would my father have painted my mother as a religious nut job, he would have used us to punish her). But he could understand violence. There is a specific sort of person who is violent specifically when they know nobody else will be. A confrontation of that sort would have at least exposed his true colors.
But nothing like that is really legal. Just like Gary wasn't allowed to kill his son's rapist (thank goodness for that jury), uncles and grandfathers are not allowed resort to things that could be called assault or battery.
Would it have actually helped anyway? I don't know. What I do know is that not being able to do anything inside the law made them effeminate on the whole issue. The most they can do is feel sad. Gone the Wild West days I suppose.
At any rate, the CPS represents the outsourcing of the larger family's responsibility to care for and control itself. The patriarchs have given up their responsibilities, not only failing to keep their daughters out of the wrong hands, but giving up handling the consequences to the state.
As barbaric as it sounds, there always needs to be a grey area where people can *take care* of issues without going to the police. Child and spousal abuse are part of this category. Even if the father doesn't care to change his wife and child beating ways, an uncle who cares about them should be able to set him straight.
We need to bring back an honor culture. The Legal system has become burdensome and impossible to work within for large segments of human society. We need honorable leaders, we need honorable men, and we need this feminized bureaucracy eradicated.
There is something genuinely “evil” about what they did to this movie, and I do not use that word lightly.
The original concept of the movie, “Ohana”, family doesn’t get left behind, has been erased, literally. The message to all these young kids is now “Abandon your family to the state when it becomes inconvenient to you, so you can chase your dreams. Leave your homeland, go to a foreign land, and abandon your family to the state”.
There is something so genuinely evil about this messaging that I refuse to believe that it was not intentional.
I do wonder if they would have made this change if Trump didn’t get elected? One of the worst traits for the modern left is to defend failed and harmful bureaucracies simply because Trump attacks them. I don’t think he’s gone after CPS in particular, but the general message of the first movie of don’t trust the government is now too right adjacent for the modern left.
We had CPS called on us because of custody BS with a conniving ex. This case worker, being more rural/small town, admitted candidly that at least 60% of all these calls were BS. She understood it was a custody power play and did not escalate it further. She didn't seem jaded yet and really wanted to rescue the tough cases. We thank God she wasn't out to get us or it could have gone so much worse.
A college friend of mine went on to law school and at some point along the way did some legal work involving CPS. He always and only referred to them as “the baby grabbers”. Sort of morbidly funny, I guess?
If have pondered child cruelty cases and I have basically came up with a mental punnett square. In what cases would the children get taken away, but the parents wouldn't go to prison? In what cases would the parents go to prison, but the children wouldn't get taken away?
In Hawaii the live action plot switch had an exceptionally poor reception since the state agencies here regularly place children in the homes of abusers where they end up getting murdered. It’s a widely recognized ongoing scandal but we are still waiting for any sort of accountability.
This all reminds me of an old Italian movie, Il Prefetto di Ferro (The Iron Prefect). It's about Cesare Mori (who was an orphan) who broke the mafia. I'm paraphrasing there, but I think at the end of the movie he says something like this to a boy:
It's not bad if you have no parents. I was too, raised by the state.
Yes, Cesare Mori was a fascist, and the era checks out, but I always liked how this thouches on the ideology.
It's funny to think that the very people, who are working at the CPS can't connect these dots.
I have to state that I'm not from the US. I'm from Hungary. The surveilance state simile I don't think stands here. There must be something very broken over there.
Even after decades of distrust sown in the populace, I don't think that anyone over here would report anyone for raising their kids as they want.
I was a free-range kid for the most part for example. And with that came, that it was everyone's responsibility, that I (and every kid on the streets) was safe. High-trust society is something else I tell you. I'm sorry for anyone who never lived in one.
Where did your sense of community went? And why does it looks like people over there don't like children?
That's one more point against moving to the US. At this point I don't even know why I wanted to move there.
I grew up in a rural area, and the free-range mentality still exists there. In more urban and suburban areas, it's largely disappeared due to loss of social trust.
When my wife and I were foster-care parents, CPS was already on the decline. They'd take a kid away, then put the parents in some bogus program that resulted in them getting their kids back weeks later, so they could do another stupid thing and start the cycle over again.
We had a child that was in daycare and did the pee-pee dance because she didn't want to leave the play table. Daycare called CPS on us, the foster-parents and investigated us.
Now, they'll take your kid away because you won't approve a sex change operation or won't give them cross-sex hormones, or call them by made up pronouns.
At the time we were foster-parents, I worked for the state prison system. Because I refused to bow down to CPSs stupid arbitrary rules, I was called a creepy person. Keep in mind, I dealt with child molesters and rapists every day, so I had a low tolerance for BS.
As someone who has a resume that cou probably get me into a job in CPS, this almost makes me want to go into the field in order to be as fair an equitable a case worker as possible. The biggest problem with bureaucrats is they almost never have the human discretion their position needs. Too often they are robotic, unfeeling and disconnected, and maybe part of the problem is not enough decent people going in there and truly trying to fix the problem.
Re: busybodies, there's an irony in that on my street, I am seen as a neglectful mother because I let my children do things like play outside and even walk to school, church, and other places without me, and for the most part I let them resolve conflicts by themselves. I constantly have to work against the pressure to do otherwise because I firmly believe that this is the best thing for my kids and for me, even risking a CPS call (there's only one person who I really think would actually do this but who hasn't so far. But it's a source of anxiety for sure!)
Where I live is safe, though not risk free. The biggest hazard is people who drive like maniacs down residential streets because they don't anticipate pedestrians. I spend a lot of time teaching road awareness for this reason.
Even with the risks, though, I still fall on the side of doing things with lots of instruction on safety rather than not doing them at all. If I truly felt it wasn't safe for my children to play normally outside or walk a few blocks unattended, I would be doing everything in my power to move to a place where they could.
CPS should be abolished and actual cases of child cruelty should be handled by the police.
Agreed. I have trouble seeing instances where you're cruel enough to lose the kids but not enough for jail.
The only situation I can think of is gross incompetence.
But then, should you not still lose the kids? Parental rights still need to weigh more heavily than they currently do. Things have to be really, really bad before it's better for the child(ren) to live with strangers. We need to give judgmental power back to relatives or the community to intervene, not the state.
In my early childhood my father was physically abusive. I wanted somebody to do something. But I never wanted CPS. I knew that purely because my mother homeschooled us (her choice, my dad didn't care one way or the other and he, to use his own words, knew how to hurt people in ways that didn't leave evidence, so its not like we would have been noticed at school), CPS would not merely take us away from my father but also take me away from mother.
No, who I wanted to do something were the men in the family. Sometimes I wondered if they were just to stupid to notice. Then I wondered if they didn't care. Finally as an adult I realized that the law had mostly stripped them of the power to do anything. Just giving my dad a talking to was pointless. Seperation would only have resulted in split custody (not only would my father have painted my mother as a religious nut job, he would have used us to punish her). But he could understand violence. There is a specific sort of person who is violent specifically when they know nobody else will be. A confrontation of that sort would have at least exposed his true colors.
But nothing like that is really legal. Just like Gary wasn't allowed to kill his son's rapist (thank goodness for that jury), uncles and grandfathers are not allowed resort to things that could be called assault or battery.
Would it have actually helped anyway? I don't know. What I do know is that not being able to do anything inside the law made them effeminate on the whole issue. The most they can do is feel sad. Gone the Wild West days I suppose.
At any rate, the CPS represents the outsourcing of the larger family's responsibility to care for and control itself. The patriarchs have given up their responsibilities, not only failing to keep their daughters out of the wrong hands, but giving up handling the consequences to the state.
As barbaric as it sounds, there always needs to be a grey area where people can *take care* of issues without going to the police. Child and spousal abuse are part of this category. Even if the father doesn't care to change his wife and child beating ways, an uncle who cares about them should be able to set him straight.
Interesting how people use the word "abuse" instead of "cruelty".
We need to bring back an honor culture. The Legal system has become burdensome and impossible to work within for large segments of human society. We need honorable leaders, we need honorable men, and we need this feminized bureaucracy eradicated.
There is something genuinely “evil” about what they did to this movie, and I do not use that word lightly.
The original concept of the movie, “Ohana”, family doesn’t get left behind, has been erased, literally. The message to all these young kids is now “Abandon your family to the state when it becomes inconvenient to you, so you can chase your dreams. Leave your homeland, go to a foreign land, and abandon your family to the state”.
There is something so genuinely evil about this messaging that I refuse to believe that it was not intentional.
I do wonder if they would have made this change if Trump didn’t get elected? One of the worst traits for the modern left is to defend failed and harmful bureaucracies simply because Trump attacks them. I don’t think he’s gone after CPS in particular, but the general message of the first movie of don’t trust the government is now too right adjacent for the modern left.
We had CPS called on us because of custody BS with a conniving ex. This case worker, being more rural/small town, admitted candidly that at least 60% of all these calls were BS. She understood it was a custody power play and did not escalate it further. She didn't seem jaded yet and really wanted to rescue the tough cases. We thank God she wasn't out to get us or it could have gone so much worse.
A college friend of mine went on to law school and at some point along the way did some legal work involving CPS. He always and only referred to them as “the baby grabbers”. Sort of morbidly funny, I guess?
If have pondered child cruelty cases and I have basically came up with a mental punnett square. In what cases would the children get taken away, but the parents wouldn't go to prison? In what cases would the parents go to prison, but the children wouldn't get taken away?
In Hawaii the live action plot switch had an exceptionally poor reception since the state agencies here regularly place children in the homes of abusers where they end up getting murdered. It’s a widely recognized ongoing scandal but we are still waiting for any sort of accountability.
https://www.civilbeat.org/2024/11/hawaiis-child-welfare-system-needs-major-reform-report-says/
This all reminds me of an old Italian movie, Il Prefetto di Ferro (The Iron Prefect). It's about Cesare Mori (who was an orphan) who broke the mafia. I'm paraphrasing there, but I think at the end of the movie he says something like this to a boy:
It's not bad if you have no parents. I was too, raised by the state.
Yes, Cesare Mori was a fascist, and the era checks out, but I always liked how this thouches on the ideology.
It's funny to think that the very people, who are working at the CPS can't connect these dots.
I have to state that I'm not from the US. I'm from Hungary. The surveilance state simile I don't think stands here. There must be something very broken over there.
Even after decades of distrust sown in the populace, I don't think that anyone over here would report anyone for raising their kids as they want.
I was a free-range kid for the most part for example. And with that came, that it was everyone's responsibility, that I (and every kid on the streets) was safe. High-trust society is something else I tell you. I'm sorry for anyone who never lived in one.
Where did your sense of community went? And why does it looks like people over there don't like children?
That's one more point against moving to the US. At this point I don't even know why I wanted to move there.
I grew up in a rural area, and the free-range mentality still exists there. In more urban and suburban areas, it's largely disappeared due to loss of social trust.
Do you know of this one for second order effects?
https://papers.ssrn.com/sol3/papers.cfm?abstract_id=3665046
As a dad with two boosters and two car seats in my van, I feel this.
When my wife and I were foster-care parents, CPS was already on the decline. They'd take a kid away, then put the parents in some bogus program that resulted in them getting their kids back weeks later, so they could do another stupid thing and start the cycle over again.
We had a child that was in daycare and did the pee-pee dance because she didn't want to leave the play table. Daycare called CPS on us, the foster-parents and investigated us.
Now, they'll take your kid away because you won't approve a sex change operation or won't give them cross-sex hormones, or call them by made up pronouns.
At the time we were foster-parents, I worked for the state prison system. Because I refused to bow down to CPSs stupid arbitrary rules, I was called a creepy person. Keep in mind, I dealt with child molesters and rapists every day, so I had a low tolerance for BS.
That was considered creepy.
As someone who has a resume that cou probably get me into a job in CPS, this almost makes me want to go into the field in order to be as fair an equitable a case worker as possible. The biggest problem with bureaucrats is they almost never have the human discretion their position needs. Too often they are robotic, unfeeling and disconnected, and maybe part of the problem is not enough decent people going in there and truly trying to fix the problem.
In the movie Lilo gets adopted by a neighbor lady who is kind of family, not properly put into foster care.
This has zero bearing on the rest of the article and I can’t say where my need to shill for the remake of a children's movie is coming from but…
Re: busybodies, there's an irony in that on my street, I am seen as a neglectful mother because I let my children do things like play outside and even walk to school, church, and other places without me, and for the most part I let them resolve conflicts by themselves. I constantly have to work against the pressure to do otherwise because I firmly believe that this is the best thing for my kids and for me, even risking a CPS call (there's only one person who I really think would actually do this but who hasn't so far. But it's a source of anxiety for sure!)
I'm working awfully hard at neglecting my kids!
The 180 turn from latchkey kids to attachment parenting has been a disaster. There's a balance here.
Where I live is safe, though not risk free. The biggest hazard is people who drive like maniacs down residential streets because they don't anticipate pedestrians. I spend a lot of time teaching road awareness for this reason.
Even with the risks, though, I still fall on the side of doing things with lots of instruction on safety rather than not doing them at all. If I truly felt it wasn't safe for my children to play normally outside or walk a few blocks unattended, I would be doing everything in my power to move to a place where they could.